This is the recent traffic on the #SPF-council IRC channel on
irc.pobox.com. Anyone may join the channel, but only council
members can talk.
| 22:37 | <csm-laptop> | I motion for approval of that PR |
| 22:37 | <MarkK> | 2237u: yes |
| 22:38 | <csm-laptop> | MarkK: do you second? |
| 22:38 | <MarkK> | sorry, seconded |
| 22:38 | <freeside> | i think we should add a few more names to the Press Contact list |
| 22:38 | <csm-laptop> | votes? |
| 22:38 | <MarkK> | 2237u: yes |
| 22:38 | <csm-laptop> | freeside: who? |
| 22:38 | <freeside> | in case i'm, like, on a plane or something. |
| 22:38 | <Julian> | freeside: Might be worth it. |
| 22:38 | <freeside> | all of us, i guess |
| 22:38 | <MarkK> | I thought it was just perfect |
| 22:38 | <csm-laptop> | we can add me... |
| 22:38 | <csm-laptop> | I am in the states and do not mind having my cell phone known |
| 22:38 | <freeside> | why not the whole council. |
| 22:39 | <Julian> | Hmm, you mean <spf-council@moongroup.com>? |
| 22:39 | <Julian> | Or what? |
| 22:39 | <csm-laptop> | freeside: we can do that |
| 22:39 | <freeside> | we can say Press Contact (please CC everybody) |
| 22:39 | <Julian> | I don't think we should add 5 distinct names, that would confuse reporters. |
| 22:40 | <csm-laptop> | well I agree we need more than one... |
| 22:40 | <csm-laptop> | 5 is too many |
| 22:40 | <Julian> | I can act as a Europe contact. |
| 22:40 | <Julian> | Or Mark? |
| 22:40 | <freeside> | let's put csm and julian or mark |
| 22:40 | <freeside> | up to you guys, really |
| 22:40 | <csm-laptop> | okay... |
| 22:41 | <csm-laptop> | Julian: write this down... |
| 22:41 | <Julian> | MarkK? |
| 22:41 | <csm-laptop> | 919-621-0605 (cell) |
| 22:41 | <Julian> | freeside: What about your name? |
| 22:41 | <Julian> | Keep it as it is? |
| 22:41 | <freeside> | yes, sure |
| 22:41 | <Julian> | k |
| 22:41 | <Julian> | I'll apply said changes later, ok? |
| 22:42 | <Julian> | Any other changes? |
| 22:42 | <csm-laptop> | MarkK: is it to be you or Julian in Europe |
| 22:42 | <csm-laptop> | ? |
| 22:42 | <MarkK> | soory, major lag |
| 22:42 | <MarkK> | I am fine with it |
| 22:42 | <Julian> | MarkK: I mean, would you want to act as the Europe contact? |
| 22:42 | <csm-laptop> | but will it be you or Julian as the european press contact? |
| 22:43 | <MarkK> | I see julian already volunteered for it; but I can act as backup |
| 22:43 | <csm-laptop> | well we're going to be doing this with every release |
| 22:43 | <Julian> | No backup, that'd mean we'd have to list 4 names. Too many. |
| 22:43 | <csm-laptop> | honestly... two in the US and one in Europe I hope will be enough |
| 22:43 | <Julian> | MarkK: Come on, here's you chance to get famous! ;-) |
| 22:44 | <csm-laptop> | he-he |
| 22:44 | <csm-laptop> | honestly Julian already does enough... |
| 22:44 | <MarkK> | Ok, I'll gladly do it; I just did not want to get in the way of julian |
| 22:44 | <Julian> | But I can do it if Mark doesn't want to. |
| 22:44 | <csm-laptop> | share the joy MarkK |
| 22:44 | <Julian> | MarkK: LOL, get in my way?? No way. |
| 22:44 | <csm-laptop> | okay so Julian get Mark's info... and add mine as well... |
| 22:44 | <Julian> | Yup. |
| 22:44 | <csm-laptop> | okay so... |
| 22:44 | <Julian> | Any other changes? |
| 22:45 | <csm-laptop> | I motion we approve the press release with those additions |
| 22:45 | <MarkK> | Like I said, I was quite happy with the way it was |
| 22:45 | <Julian> | freeside? |
| 22:45 | <csm-laptop> | MarkK was that a second? |
| 22:45 | <MarkK> | yes :) |
| 22:45 | <csm-laptop> | votes? |
| 22:45 | <MarkK> | 2245u: yes |
| 22:45 | <freeside> | w00t |
| 22:45 | <freeside> | where's grumpy? |
| 22:45 | <csm-laptop> | 2245u: yes |
| 22:46 | <freeside> | 2245u: abstain |
| 22:46 | <Julian> | 2245u: yes |
| 22:46 | <csm-laptop> | so ordered... |
| 22:46 | <Julian> | freeside: For the record, why your abstention? |
| 22:47 | <MarkK> | (am curious too) |
| 22:47 | <freeside> | i'm worried it'll confuse people and hold back adoption |
| 22:47 | <freeside> | but hey, motion passes, i'll drop it on the website after the names are added. |
| 22:47 | <Julian> | freeside: Can you specify that? |
| 22:47 | <freeside> | any amount of dissension between the SPF community and the MS side tends to make people worry. |
| 22:48 | <Julian> | I see. |
| 22:48 | <freeside> | so, i'm thinking of the fence sitters |
| 22:48 | <freeside> | but it's not a big deal. |
| 22:48 | <Julian> | Ok. |
| 22:48 | <Julian> | Good. |
| 22:48 | <csm-laptop> | well IMHO... it clarifies some things that we've needed to clarify for some time |
| 22:48 | <MarkK> | (It is MS who took the link to spf off, iirc.) |
| 22:49 | <MarkK> | Yes, that clarification was needed, imho |
| 22:49 | <freeside> | mail.com has withdrawn their spf record, btw, because of the problem with forwarding. they seem to think that -all is required in SPF. back in november i chatted with markl about this, and he said if he had a chance to do it over, he would've left out all the "all" business. |
| 22:49 | <Julian> | I agree with csm-laptop and MarkK. |
| 22:49 | <freeside> | yeah, i agree we should just get it out there and move on. |
| 22:50 | <Julian> | freeside: grumpy went to pick up his kids. |
| 22:50 | <Julian> | (about 1.5h ago) |
| 22:50 | <MarkK> | so, lets talk HSARPA :) |
| 22:51 | <Julian> | Yes, let's move on. csm-laptop? |
| 22:51 | <csm-laptop> | yeah... 'cause I am now done |
| 22:51 | <MarkK> | wasn't that the next item? |
| 22:51 | <csm-laptop> | ED's report is next |
| 22:51 | <Julian> | "Status of HSARPA proposal? Other fund-raising efforts?" |
| 22:51 | <freeside> | HSARPA came back negged by Doughlas Maughan, the program manager. |
| 22:52 | <freeside> | they're supposed to schedule a post-mortem for us. |
| 22:52 | <freeside> | i haven't heard anything about this yet. |
| 22:52 | <Julian> | Did they include any comments? Or just a "no"? |
| 22:52 | <MarkK> | that sucks |
| 22:52 | <freeside> | it was just a "no", the comments should happen in the post mortem. |
| 22:52 | <Julian> | Ok. Any time-frame for that? |
| 22:53 | <freeside> | i had a phone call with ms, and a few months ago i had a chat with yahoo, and my impression was that if the funding didn't work, they might be a potential purse to help fund MTA integration development. |
| 22:53 | <freeside> | time frame for the post morten they said by end of march. |
| 22:53 | <Julian> | Ok. |
| 22:53 | <MarkK> | what do you mean 'schedule'? as in have atalk with you? |
| 22:53 | <freeside> | i also submitted another grant proposal to, i think, NSF, in conjunction with a professor in florida. that'll take about 6 months to respond, so don't hold your breath. |
| 22:53 | <freeside> | yeah, they're supposed to do a phone call or something. |
| 22:54 | <Julian> | freeside: Perhaps you can record that phone call. That would be great. |
| 22:54 | <Julian> | (If they agree to that, that is.) |
| 22:54 | <freeside> | yeah, i'll give you guys a full report once that's done. |
| 22:54 | <freeside> | so maybe we should look to yahoo, ibm, ms, etc for funding to do the MTA development described in the Cheeseplate proposal. |
| 22:54 | <Julian> | Does that make _two_ proposals to the NSF? |
| 22:54 | <freeside> | the first one was to HSARPA, the second was to NSF> |
| 22:55 | <Julian> | So we already heard from you about the NSF one. |
| 22:55 | <Julian> | Although briefly. |
| 22:55 | <freeside> | right. |
| 22:56 | <freeside> | so that's it for the development funding grant side of things. |
| 22:56 | <Julian> | Ok, I'd like to add that I plan on looking for government sponsorship from the EU and Germany within the next two to three months. |
| 22:56 | <Julian> | Funding, that is. |
| 22:56 | <freeside> | excellent, let me know and i can send you the source files for the proposals. |
| 22:56 | <Julian> | I may need a translated proposal for the German agencies. |
| 22:57 | <Julian> | Perhaps I'll find the time to translate it myself. |
| 22:57 | <Julian> | freeside: Anything else you'd like to report on? |
| 22:59 | <freeside> | yeah.... |
| 22:59 | <freeside> | so here's what i've been up to for the last few weeks... |
| 22:59 | <freeside> | i've been missing meetings, i know, so you should know why :) |
| 22:59 | * | freeside thinks back... |
| 22:59 | <freeside> | so, feb 23 and feb 24, i was in kyoto, japan, for apricot. i presented SPF alongside Dave Crocker and Jim Fenton. |
| 23:00 | <freeside> | the next week, mar 1-3, i was in san diego, for MAAWG. i presented SPF and some SPF test results. Also at MAAWG were Dave Crocker and Doug Otis. They gave the MAAWG audience a little taste of the MARID IETF proceedings. |
| 23:00 | <csm-laptop> | oooo... I would have liked to have heard that |
| 23:00 | <Julian> | Heh. |
| 23:01 | <freeside> | i think you can imagine what it was like :) |
| 23:01 | <MarkK> | lol |
| 23:01 | <csm-laptop> | did they present it as a "kangaroo court" ? :-) |
| 23:01 | <freeside> | the next week, mar 8 and 9, i was in manhattan presenting to about 300 clients and potential clients of Bigfoot Interactive. The audience was mostly Fortune 1000 companies, marketing departments, getting exposed to sender authentication for the first time. Also on the panel were Craig Spiezle from MS, Colin O'Malley from TrustE, and a guy from Forrester research. |
| 23:02 | <Julian> | What came out of it? |
| 23:02 | <freeside> | the next week, mar 17, i was in Atlanta, presenting to an IT-ISAC.org panel on authentication and reputation. In the audience were Cisco, HP, Intel, Internet Security Services, Sandia National Labs, and others. |
| 23:02 | <Julian> | Any feedback? |
| 23:02 | <freeside> | on mar 18 i was in Bethesda, MD, outside Washington DC, presenting to Marriott on how they need to publish SPF records. |
| 23:02 | <freeside> | so, that's the last four weeks :) |
| 23:03 | <freeside> | nothing really comes out of these panels, it's pretty unidirectional. |
| 23:03 | <Julian> | Hmm... |
| 23:03 | <freeside> | at MAAWG, i did blow everyone's minds by suggesting that if we fail to save email, we might see a combination of IM and RSS technologies start to do a lot of things that email does today. |
| 23:03 | <freeside> | that was an idea from andy newton. |
| 23:04 | <Julian> | freeside: I'm interested. From your perspective, what's the point of giving these speeches? Do companies learn that they should adopt SPF? Or is it something else? |
| 23:04 | <freeside> | in other news, the IBM FairUCE "spam the spammers" thing is a total misrepresentation. apparently MessageLabs is using TurnTide, and IBM is reselling MessageLabs. FairUCE has nothing to do with that. In both cases there's no "spamming spammers". |
| 23:04 | <freeside> | yeah, it's to promote SPF and educate the masses on sender authentication. |
| 23:05 | <freeside> | getting ISPs and organizations to publish records, and to start checking, and so on. |
| 23:05 | <freeside> | most of the people coming to these talks know only the barest minimum about sender authentication, so i talk about how it fits into the larger scheme of antispam accountability, and what it means specifically for each segment of the ecosystem. the marketers are very interested in differentiating themselves from spammers, of course. |
| 23:05 | <Julian> | Is there any outlook on crypto-based sender auth or even message-crypto (S/MIME & PGP)? |
| 23:06 | <freeside> | ISPs are interested in using sender-based filtering, and reputation systems, to get away from content filtering, which is expensive. |
| 23:06 | <freeside> | the party line at these talks is to do SPF/SenderID, and DomainKeys/IIM both. |
| 23:06 | <Julian> | ...cause that's (S/MIME, PGP) what I think we'll need to be going long-term. |
| 23:06 | <freeside> | the message-crypto stuff, there's some commercial activity ... http://www.echoworx.com/ recently appeared on the radar. they claim to have solved the key distribution and management problem part of the PKI problem. |
| 23:06 | <MarkK> | did you get to promote your karma stuff? |
| 23:06 | <freeside> | so that's something you guys might want to check out. |
| 23:07 | <freeside> | i've been talking quietly about karma with stakeholders, and they all think it's a great idea. the next step is to actually make some business deals and to get some development happening. |
| 23:07 | <freeside> | oh, right. |
| 23:07 | <Julian> | What key distribution and management problems? I didn't knew there actually was a problem. |
| 23:07 | <freeside> | at maawg i presented some testing results. |
| 23:07 | <MarkK> | cool |
| 23:07 | <freeside> | i'll send out those test results to spf-private in a moment |
| 23:08 | <Julian> | Why private? |
| 23:08 | <freeside> | it's an early draft, not quite finished. when we ahve a more final draft we can put out a PR and i'll publish the results on the website and to spf-council. |
| 23:08 | <freeside> | it's probably still got typos in it and so on |
| 23:08 | <freeside> | i'll try to get it cleaned up in a week |
| 23:09 | <freeside> | so check your mailboxes for that. |
| 23:09 | * | Julian will do later. |
| 23:10 | <csm-laptop> | anything else freeside? |
| 23:10 | <freeside> | err, nope |
| 23:11 | <freeside> | i'm a little behind on spf-discuss. |
| 23:11 | <csm-laptop> | okay... unless there are questions... (I saw a few go unanswered) |
| 23:11 | <freeside> | and we should talk about revamping the spf.pobox.com site with shared write access. |
| 23:11 | <freeside> | what questions did i miss? |
| 23:11 | <MarkK> | yes! |
| 23:11 | <Julian> | What key distribution and management problems? I didn't knew there actually was a problem. |
| 23:11 | <MarkK> | julian: me neither |
| 23:12 | <csm-laptop> | me 3 |
| 23:12 | <Julian> | ("didn't knOw", that is.) |
| 23:12 | * | Julian is still digesting his pizza. |
| 23:14 | <freeside> | okay ... |
| 23:14 | <freeside> | i propose a motion that julian should digest his pizza. |
| 23:14 | <csm-laptop> | well I think maybe freeside ought to try to answer the ?? |
| 23:15 | <freeside> | oh. well, key distribution is considered difficult, and that's generally held to be the reason SMIME and PGP haven't been more widely accepted. |
| 23:15 | <freeside> | that's the problem. |
| 23:16 | <Julian> | Well, ok, that would need to be discussed more thoroughly, but we don't have to do that now. |
| 23:16 | <MarkK> | hmm, there I was thinking corrupted signatures for mail in transit was the problem; not getting the keys out. :) guess I was wrong |
| 23:16 | <Julian> | I doubt there is a real problem. All tools that might possibly be required are there. |
| 23:17 | <Julian> | Any other unanswered questions? |
| 23:17 | <freeside> | ok, is the website up next for us to talk about? |
| 23:17 | <Julian> | freeside: Not just yet. |
| 23:17 | <Julian> | freeside: See the agenda at $optic. |
| 23:17 | <Julian> | freeside: See the agenda at $toptic. |
| 23:18 | <freeside> | ok. |
| 23:18 | * | Julian can't type. Bah. |
| 23:19 | * | MarkK reminds julian that irc does not do string-parsing like Perl. :) |
| 23:20 | <MarkK> | seriously, though, I believe commending wayne is next |
| 23:20 | <Julian> | csm-laptop? |
| 23:20 | <MarkK> | right? |
| 23:20 | <csm-laptop> | present the motion |
| 23:21 | <Julian> | Ok. |
| 23:21 | <MarkK> | I make a motion to commend wayne for his CBR Online interview |
| 23:21 | * | csm-laptop seconds |
| 23:22 | <Julian> | Frank Ellerman suggested that the council commend Wayne for his CBR Online interview, like the council commended me for setting up the council website. |
| 23:22 | <freeside> | where's the url for that interview? |
| 23:22 | <Julian> | It's in the agenda. |
| 23:22 | <freeside> | wow, footnotes. |
| 23:22 | <freeside> | crazy. thanks. |
| 23:23 | <Julian> | freeside: The article is based on that interview. |
| 23:23 | <MarkK> | yep, julian is "punktlich". :) |
| 23:23 | <Julian> | MarkK: What do you mean? |
| 23:23 | <Julian> | (Oh, and it's "pnktlich", with two "punkt"s above the "u". *g*) |
| 23:24 | <csm-laptop> | votes? |
| 23:24 | <MarkK> | (I could not get the umlaut (perhaps I should have used ue, then) |
| 23:24 | <csm-laptop> | votes? |
| 23:24 | <Julian> | 2321u: yes |
| 23:24 | <MarkK> | 2321u: yes |
| 23:24 | <csm-laptop> | 2321u: yes |
| 23:25 | <freeside> | 2321u: yes |
| 23:25 | <csm-laptop> | so ordered |
| 23:25 | <freeside> | i wonder who was responsible for the nice insightful paragraph |
| 23:25 | <freeside> | The SPF community appears to be divided into three broad camps: the Microsoft-haters, who dislike whatever comes out of Redmond on principle, the technology purists, who believe SPF is simply the superior spec, and the negotiators, those who are trying to bring Microsoft back on board, possibly by making technical concessions. |
| 23:25 | <csm-laptop> | guys... I have 6 minutes left |
| 23:25 | <Julian> | I guess Wayne told him that. |
| 23:25 | <Julian> | Ugh. |
| 23:25 | <csm-laptop> | you guys should go ahead and start the web site discussion... |
| 23:26 | <MarkK> | guys, in that case I make a motion to go to the website stuff immediately |
| 23:26 | <Julian> | freeside: Can you show up tomorrow 22:00 or 22:30? |
| 23:26 | <freeside> | the press release will go out, no problem |
| 23:26 | <csm-laptop> | I will be fine with whatever you decide |
| 23:26 | <freeside> | tomorrow this time will be difficult, i have an evening meeting scheduled from 2100 to 2600UTC |
| 23:26 | <csm-laptop> | freeside: the press release go out? |
| 23:26 | <csm-laptop> | are you going to send it to PR newswire? |
| 23:26 | <freeside> | on spf-announce, which is the next thing |
| 23:26 | <csm-laptop> | okay... |
| 23:26 | <freeside> | i don't know how to submit to PRnewswire. |
| 23:26 | <freeside> | i will put it on the website though |
| 23:26 | <csm-laptop> | well I have a channel open for that now |
| 23:26 | <freeside> | ok, you do it then. |
| 23:27 | <Julian> | Well, the next item said "_general_ operation", so... But we can take care of that another day. |
| 23:27 | <freeside> | let's get it out on the lists first though as a courtesy :) |
| 23:27 | <csm-laptop> | yes... you do what you're saying and I will get it out the rest of the way |
| 23:27 | <freeside> | for the website, can we bring up a shared site somewhere that we can all get our hands dirty on? |
| 23:27 | <csm-laptop> | Julian: send me the final copy |
| 23:27 | <Julian> | csm-laptop: I will |
| 23:27 | <csm-laptop> | okay... |
| 23:27 | <Julian> | freeside: Not so quick. |
| 23:27 | <freeside> | i would like a CVS thingy, with a development site, that we all have commit access to, and preferably shell access as well. |
| 23:27 | <csm-laptop> | and on that notw I am out of here guys |
| 23:27 | * | freeside waits. |
| 23:28 | <Julian> | We just lost quorum. |
| 23:28 | <MarkK> | ??????? that was not 6 minutes! |
| 23:28 | * | Julian assumes the role of vice chair. |
| 23:28 | <freeside> | i'm sure grumpy will pop up again in a few minutes. |
| 23:28 | <Julian> | Everyone ok with that? |
| 23:28 | <MarkK> | sigh; now we did not get to talk about the website again! |
| 23:28 | <MarkK> | yes |
| 23:28 | <freeside> | well, let's talk about it anyway, even if we don't want to vote on it |
| 23:28 | <Julian> | Yep. |
| 23:29 | <freeside> | argh, i just gave myself a paper cut |
| 23:29 | <Julian> | Ok. "Project Website". |
| 23:29 | <freeside> | !@#$ snail mail |
| 23:29 | <Julian> | This is my report: |
| 23:31 | <Julian> | I had presented my pre-plan for the website to spf-discuss on 2005-02-26: |
| 23:32 | <Julian> | (seeking) |
| 23:36 | <freeside> | well, it's spread over three or four production machines that do a whole bunch of other things. |
| 23:37 | <freeside> | it'd be good form to have proper CVS and development/staging for it. |
| 23:37 | <freeside> | so, if we set up a new dev.spf.pobox.com website, that we can all log in to and tweak, then spf.pobox.com can mirror from that. |
| 23:37 | <Julian> | Might be true, but this also is a question of control. |
| 23:37 | <MarkK> | I would prefer the spf.pobox site, but am somewhat concerned over the potential of 'censorship' from meng (regarding sender-id and stuff); if meng can give us the assurance that this will not occur, then most of *my* concerns are gone |
| 23:38 | <Julian> | I wouldn't put it in the terms of censorship, but more in the terms of the website being editable at all times by the council. |
| 23:38 | <freeside> | well, yeah, i want it to be editable at all times by the council. |
| 23:39 | <Julian> | Some replication mechanism might be ok, but it would have to be semi-automatic, certainly not manual. |
| 23:39 | <freeside> | yup. |
| 23:39 | <MarkK> | yes; I meant, to be precise, that I dislike the idea of having to upload first, for 'approval' by meng |
| 23:39 | <freeside> | right, we'll use a cron job for that. |
| 23:40 | <Julian> | On the software, I have not received a lot of suggestions. The only variants we have is Mambo (suggested by Chuck), the enhanced UseMod Wiki (me), and someone suggested TikiPro. |
| 23:40 | <freeside> | i've been happy with mod_perl/mason. |
| 23:40 | <MarkK> | Not that I point a finger at meng, for the record; but, also for the record, I want it spelled out that we will have this shared access |
| 23:40 | <Julian> | I think we _do_ need a proper CMS, not just simple HTML or Mason files. |
| 23:40 | <freeside> | that's what the wizard uses. everything else can be done in something else. |
| 23:41 | * | freeside mildly amused that Mason not considered a proper CMS. |
| 23:41 | <Julian> | I'm leaning strongly towards the Usemod Wiki solution, because I know it can do what we need. |
| 23:41 | <Julian> | Other than that, suggestions would have to be made. |
| 23:42 | <Julian> | MarkK: I absolutely agree. |
| 23:42 | <Julian> | MarkK: It's one of the requirements. |
| 23:42 | <MarkK> | yes |
| 23:42 | <Julian> | So, on the software solution, would it be possible to set up a staging area with the wiki software, and have spf.pobox.com mirror that? |
| 23:43 | <Julian> | Either mirror the wiki installation and database, or somehow make static copies from the wiki pages? |
| 23:43 | <freeside> | if we're going to do a wiki, we don't really need staging vs production. |
| 23:43 | <freeside> | i was thinking more of a static thing when i suggested mirroring. |
| 23:44 | <Julian> | Well, as I said, I think we need a proper CMS for editing. It makes life much easier for the editors. |
| 23:44 | <Julian> | Also, the UseMod wiki performs versioning. |
| 23:45 | <Julian> | freeside: If you know a different CMS solution that you'd be willing to install or mirror, please suggest one. |
| 23:46 | <freeside> | if it's not too much work to install, go for it |
| 23:47 | <freeside> | i just hope a DOS attack against the website won't have much effect on the production services that also run on it. |
| 23:47 | <freeside> | if we install something that can't handle a DOS well, we might have to bring down the website. |
| 23:47 | <freeside> | or just host it elsewhere. |
| 23:47 | <Julian> | Well, there's two possibilities: install the site directly on spf.pobox.com (I have the impression you wanted to avoid that), or install it somewhere else and mirror it. |
| 23:48 | <MarkK> | also (not sure its turn is up), but the hosting/url of the why.htm page needs consideration too |
| 23:48 | <freeside> | i didn't know we were going to do a wiki when i suggested doing a mirroring thing :) |
| 23:48 | <freeside> | we could change the why.html to spf.info or whatever. |
| 23:48 | <Julian> | Creating static page copies when mirroring would undoubtedly solve any load problems. |
| 23:49 | <Julian> | MarkK: The why.html page is the least of our problems. You can always configure a "Alias /why.html ..." for that URL, even though you're generally using a CMS. |
| 23:50 | <MarkK> | meng, I meant that there have been talks to put the why.html page on its own url, like "http://purl.net/spf/why.html" (or on julian's registered domain) |
| 23:50 | <freeside> | sure, like http://spf.info/why.html ... |
| 23:50 | <MarkK> | but you're right, julian, getting the site first is our priority |
| 23:51 | <Julian> | Static page mirroring might be a problem for dynamic content such as a record wizard and other tools. |
| 23:51 | <Julian> | freeside: Would it be possible to install the wiki software on your server(s)? |
| 23:52 | <Julian> | It's not hard to install. |
| 23:52 | <freeside> | sure, i don't see why not. if you want to run it, i can just point spf.pobox.com at you. |
| 23:53 | <Julian> | Personally, I can't afford the traffic. |
| 23:53 | <MarkK> | (hmm, spf.info is already registered to a kim vanderlinden; but I digress). |
| 23:53 | <Julian> | So we host the website either at pobox.com or on some other server. |
| 23:53 | <MarkK> | I have a nice server too; but, like julian, I lack the required bandwidth |
| 23:54 | <Julian> | Ok, in order to make some progress... |
| 23:55 | <MarkK> | meng, as an indicator, could you perhaps find out how many hits, ball-park, the why.html page gets per day/week/whatever? |
| 23:55 | <freeside> | ok. |
| 23:55 | <freeside> | let's get a dev site up also |
| 23:55 | <freeside> | and we can get the content on there at least which is the important. |
| 23:56 | <freeside> | er, the important thing. |
| 23:56 | <Julian> | freeside: Can I contact you separately wrt installing the wiki software on spf.pobox.com, or do you strictly want to avoid that? |
| 23:57 | <freeside> | yeah, let's follow up on that |
| 23:57 | <Julian> | Ok. |
| 23:57 | <freeside> | i won't be the one doing the install, so it might get tricky. |
| 23:57 | <Julian> | Hmm, what OS is it? |
| 23:57 | <Julian> | Linux? Debian? |
| 23:57 | <freeside> | i need to ask my SA Dept to install it. which is why something in mason would've been easier. but we can do it. |
| 23:57 | <freeside> | yeah, debian. |
| 23:57 | <MarkK> | freebsd? :) |
| 23:58 | <Julian> | Good. I plan on creating a Debian package for the wiki software. |
| 23:58 | <Julian> | That should make things easy. |
| 23:58 | <Julian> | Then just the configuration would have to be done. |
| 23:58 | <Julian> | But let's talk about that by mail. |
| 23:59 | <freeside> | this is on one of the machines. |
| 23:59 | <freeside> | 20050322-18:57:03 root@portent:/var/apache/logs# grep -c why.html access_log |
| 23:59 | <freeside> | 114987 |
| 23:59 | <freeside> | 20050322-18:58:56 root@portent:/var/apache/logs# head -1 access_log |
| 23:59 | <freeside> | 208.210.125.98 - - [13/Jul/2004:13:48:38 -0400] "GET / HTTP/1.1" 200 5494 |
| 23:59 | <freeside> | i'd say, double it to get an estimate of the full load. |
| 23:59 | <freeside> | so, since July 2004, we've seen 112,000 hits to why.html. |
| 23:59 | <freeside> | which is really not that bad. |
| 23:59 | <MarkK> | 114986 per day?? |
| 23:59 | <Julian> | No, that's pretty low. |
| 23:59 | <MarkK> | oh, few :) |